The Science in Entrepreneurship

In this episode…

Nic Cary interviews Dr. Mahsa and they discuss the lessons learned during her career journey including:

• The importance of leveraging community support and mentorship to overcome challenges and grow a business.
• The value of sustainable practices and innovation in creating products that meet market demands and drive success.
• The necessity of resilience and strategic planning in navigating the entrepreneurial journey and achieving long-term goals.

Sponsor for this episode:

This episode is brought to you by Sky’s The Limit, one of the largest nonprofit programs for underrepresented young adult entrepreneurs in the US. Sky’s The Limit is a quick-growing digital platform that connects entrepreneurs with their peers, volunteer business mentors, training resources, and funding.

Our goal is to develop the social capital that founders need to chase their business dreams.

To learn more, please visit www.skysthelimit.org today.

Episode transcript

Intro (00:04):

Welcome to the First Buck Podcast where we feature stories about entrepreneurs and the people who support them. Now let's get started with the show.

Nic Cary (00:24):

Hello and welcome to The First Buck Podcast, brought to you by Skysthelimit.org. We feature stories about entrepreneurs and the people who support them. Today we're joined by Dr. Mahsa Vazin, founder of PawCo, a plant-based dog food company with a mission of making the world a greener place, one meal at a time. Dr. Vazin earned her PhD in Nanoscience as one of the very earliest scientists at Impossible Foods before founding PawCo. She's a lifelong entrepreneur and a lifelong learner, and we're really lucky to have her on the podcast today. So Dr. Vazin, tell us how did you earn your first buck?

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (01:02):

First of all, thank you for having me here today. And I would say basically I was eight, nine years old and my dad, he was an architect. So as a kid I always wanted to be financially independent, buy those things that normally I was not allowed to buy for myself. So I was painting my dad's maps and graphs, so he was giving me some money. It was more like gift, but still as a kid I started making that money and I was buying candies or those things that I wanted to have later on during my years at grad schools while I was studying master and PhD also, I had the chance to be TA teaching assistant and also make money and kind of be still financially independent. And I would say I started making real money at my first job at Impossible Foods.

Nic Cary (02:10):

So tell us a little bit about this. So you're a young entrepreneur making money with your dad, and then you become a teacher's assistant in university, helping other people get through their coursework, and then you get recruited into a very famous Silicon Valley company called Impossible Foods. How did that happen? What does Impossible Foods do? Give us an update on this because it sort of defined the whole category of something that didn't even exist 10 years ago.

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (02:38):

Exactly, exactly. That's also a very interesting story. I did my PhD in a very different field. I was very excited to start working. I did some job search and I found Impossible Foods and the logo was like a burger and I was like, the job description was matching my PhD background. I was like, how come that can be related? So I applied for the job, got my first interview of my life, and then two weeks after that I started working at Impossible Food. I got the job and working at Impossible Foods. That was my first job and I started working as a scientist and I had amazing years of working at Impossible Foods and that gives me the inspiration to actually start Pocket Foods. That's how I got inspired and I got the experiences that allow me to think about, okay, now I'm qualified to start my own company, PawCo Foods.

Nic Cary (03:44):

Mahsa tell us about PawCo Foods and the kind of pun and the play on the name there.

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (03:52):

The name PawCo came from my dog's name. It's a very funny story. I used to be scared of dogs, so surprising to know

Nic Cary (04:04):

I would not have expected that.

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (04:06):

So I was scared of dogs. I wanted to get a word that fear adopted my first dog right before pandemic without even knowing that pandemic is going to happen. His name is Paco, so I named him Paco and he's more like a kid to me. And we got really connected through pandemic and I did research as a scientist too. I didn't have any experiences. I did research about everything for his food and everything else and I saw a huge gap in the market. We couldn't find a healthy, delicious and sustainable eco-friendly pet food. And that's how I got into starting this company, founding PawCo Foods. And the name was definitely, I should have picked something related to the love of my life. My kid Paco. I named it Paco, but with W.

Nic Cary (05:04):

Okay, so like a paw or paw print. Love it. So I think this is really interesting. The pet market is way bigger than people probably realize. So give us some figures. I think this is something entrepreneurs sometimes need a little bit of guidance on is to think about what is usually called your total addressable market. And so when you hear somebody say they want to start a new clothing line, they think about the total number of people that buy all of the world's clothes or a new shoe line and all the sneaker shoes. Tell us a little bit about the pet market and its size and what surprised you about this gap?

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (05:44):

So it's a great question. The pet market is a huge market, especially in us, especially after pandemic. Actually dogs and pets were considered as pandemic purchased and lots of people adopted a dog or a cat during the pandemic and the pet market, it's growing so fast it's expected to actually get to 57 billion in a few years. And also the same thing for the plant-based pet market. It's already 56 billion globally and it's increasing 10% yearly. So it's a huge, huge market and it's also growing super, super fast.

Nic Cary (06:35):

Yeah, I think you're onto something really interesting here because over the last five or six years we've sort of raised our consciousness globally on the impact that animal farming and fish farming is having on the environment. And so I want you to hear a little bit about this because I think most people probably have some misconceptions like canines or dogs can only eat canned meat food. That's not the case. The science doesn't back that. So it's sort of just changing people's attitude about it. And what have you learned about the science and nutrition around making a wholesome meal out of non-meat products for pets?

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (07:16):

So still there are lots of people that think the dog, they are carnivore, which is not true.

Nic Cary (07:27):

I think the amount of grass my dog eats would definitely just dispel that myth.

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (07:32):

Exactly. And they are actually consider, there are lots of recent studies that shows dogs, they are actually like human, they are omnivore and they can thrive on plant-based diet. There are lots of interesting actually data out there that shows that dogs on vegan or vegetarian diet, actually they live a year and a half longer than those on traditional type of diet. So a year and a half in dog's life is almost 10 years of human life. So that's really showing that plant-based diet can be even healthier for them. And it's also so surprising to know that we already have about 70 million dogs in us. 10% of them, which is a huge number, are already on vegan or vegetarian diet for different reason. And the main reason is allergy. The top three allergen for dogs are actually animal-based product. Chicken, beef and dairy are the top three allergen for dogs. There are other reason for pet owners to choose vegan diet for their dog. It's also they are vegan or vegetarian themselves and they want to support animal welfare or they consider they really want to find a sustainable and eco-friendly type of product for their dog. So there are those three main categories that we see. They are really looking for this type of food.

Nic Cary (09:10):

Interesting. I don't think I knew that about the allergens being probably the predominant ingredients that most pet owners are actually feeding their animals, but it makes sense. And dogs have all kinds of similar problems that humans do to intolerances on a chemical level of all kinds of things. And so finding healthy replacements makes a lot of sense and I definitely understand the gap that you're filling right now. So I want to talk a little bit about what you've learned in this journey. So from the time you're helping your dad to being in uni and helping educate people, which I'm sure is a really important part of your job now, educating the market about how having even a potentially plant-based diet for a pet could extend their life, I bet that one bit of evidence may be the most powerful one you have because the bond that people have with their pets is so strong they would do anything to extend that time with them. So I think that's an amazing point. Talk to us a little bit about how you went about founding this business, who was involved and how did you get started? Because I think a lot of people sometimes see ideas or gaps in the market, but they don't know how to take that next first step. And I'd love to hear from you how you went about doing that. Starting a pet food business requires some money. So talk to us about what you experienced and what you could teach someone else about from that process.

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (10:37):

Yeah, definitely. So to be honest, being a founder is definitely challenging. It's definitely not easy. I'm sure you know that so well yourself, but we should think about it as a kind of a step by step or a process, not like a switch that you want to turn it on, you take baby step toward your goal and you can get help from lots of people like this amazing organization that you, for example, created for founders. Female founders can be something that those who are interested about starting their a startup and company, they can join, they can learn from other founders from that community or other friends and family or the community. And it was the case for us. We basically bootstrap the company, had friends and family supported us to take the company from the ground and take it to the next level, next step and start raising money and basically start launching product. So it's more of the process and there are lots of community. For example, in our case, we partner with those nonprofit organizations like PETA Plant-based food association or another nonprofit organization that we partner with them. So they also support and promote Pocket Foods. You can always get help. You are not alone. It's not like a one man type of job and it's more like a team job that you find those people to believe in that there's the same vision and mission. So we can basically get help and some knowledge from other peoples as well.

Nic Cary (12:43):

I think I can see where your doctoral training is coming out in merging with being an entrepreneur. And it's funny because I really agree that they're both sort of similar processes, which is you have to test an idea and then you have your assumptions in a hypothesis and then you tinker on it and you keep doing that. And basically entrepreneurs that follow the scientific process oftentimes have really better outcomes because they're really using data as opposed to just how they feel about something to really prove that there's a problem being met, that their product is improving and that they're sort of applying this methodology to constantly assess and improve something. And so that makes a lot of sense to me. We teach a lean startup method at Sky's the Limit, which is basically the scientific method for building a small business. And so you start with your idea, you go interview customers, you size the market, you find out if there's competition, you get as much feedback as you can about customer problems, how they feel about the product, and you bundle all of that up together and you start to sell it. So I love this point you made about finding communities that are allies like these nonprofit organizations. In your case, this is a real, I would say, cheat code for entrepreneurs that are beginning to come to market and go sell is to have other people do that for you.

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (14:04):

Exactly. And one thing about us, which also it's very interesting to know, is that about this plant-based or plant-based pet product, you don't see other companies out there as a competitors. We are always even promoting each other because that's another validation about what we are doing is, and we all believe in the same mission supporting animal welfare supporting environment, and also supporting animal health. We have the same vision and mission and we even support each other in this community.

Nic Cary (14:43):

Oh, that's cool. Yeah, that's where everyone's sort of allied in solving the big problem, which is just taking better care of our pets and our planet. I definitely see that passion that you're describing. So let's cut real. What is one of the hardest things you've had to deal with if you so far you're like, ugh, that was just really tough and I didn't expect that. As a founder,

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (15:11):

I would say everything is kind of challenging as a founder, especially as a female founder in this men dominant kind of founder community, basically you really need to prove yourself. You really need to show that you are capable of really leading the company. Your product is the product that there is a demand for. And in our case, that was the reason that we wanted to bootstrap the company and start showing revenue, start launching the product and then start basically raising capital and go to the fundraising part. So that was definitely a challenging, and I think for us, our product really, really worked well. We had really customers that they were really so happy because they were always looking for something like this product. Their dog had allergies and there's not on their product like US Plant-based meat, fresh plant-based dog food in the market. So we were the first one launching it.

(16:31):

So I think after we show that revenue, we show those feedback from the customers. So that was the very good thing that happened for us and for PawCo. And the other highlight for us was when we actually won the Agan food, the rally in pitch competition in Indiana, out of 500 startups, we were first five and then PawCo won the Agan Food competition and we won the rally and that was run by Elevate Venture and that's how we got actually the lead for this round of fundraising seed round. So they invested in Park. Now we are about to open our second production site in Indiana.

Nic Cary (17:20):

Wow, cool. So I think your story here is so good. It teaches some really good, I say foundational lessons in building businesses and it's sort of matching where you are with the right resources. If you start out with too much money, you can actually go in the wrong direction. And bootstrapping a business brings sharply into focus all of the immediate problems and it really helps prioritize what you're working on. And ultimately that's building a product that people love. And if you get early adopters that share your story for you, you can really take that as evidence to go scale up and it's about doubling and then tripling and getting bigger, but doing it in a way that puts a foundation in place. And I think by now having gone through a fundraise to basically speed up what you're doing, it's like putting a rocket fuel on something as opposed to actually just using that money to try and figure out whether or not your idea was right in the first place.

(18:19):

Exactly. And so a lot of founders start off their journey thinking, God, if I only had money then all my problems would be solved. But in a lot of ways you got to sort of solve a lot of the early problems with just the resources and the support that you can put to it and then really prove that there's a problem that other people will pay you to fix or solve. And then once you can do that, then access to capital not only gets easier, it comes on better terms and it's not just used to test your idea out, but to actually grow the whole thing, which is what makes a much more sustainable business model. So your story is just awesome for all those reasons. I want to hear about anybody that's been special to you. Have you had any mentor advisors or professors when you look back that were just, and what role did they have in helping you think about business forge your business? Did you have any important mentors in your career?

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (19:18):

Definitely. I had amazing mentors through my academic grad school and also industry work years. One special person I would definitely mention is Pat Brown, the founder of Impossible Foods. I think he was probably the person open my eyes into how we can actually have an impact on a lot of things, like on the environment, on animal welfare, create something like this plant-based concept. Probably the way that people are looking at plant-based product for human was totally different than these days. And I think the reason is probably because of Impossible Foods and those companies like that. And definitely Pat Brown was a great person for me to look up to him and have him as a role model in my career.

Nic Cary (20:21):

Cool. Yeah, I mean you can see how Impossible Foods planted the seeds that in some ways are now sprouting a whole bunch of new business ideas serving different markets and ultimately creating this sort of cascading effect of helping people reimagine their relationship with food sources and how those food sources are consumed, the proteins, everything else. And I just love that story. So all I, I'll ask you one last question. I think your perspective on this will just be so good. Taking the steps to pursue entrepreneurship can really feel scary to people. What tips can you give our listeners for how to manage some of the stress that comes with running your own business?

Dr. Mahsa Vazin (21:05):

So as I mentioned, definitely it's not easy to be a founder and a startup company, but I think these days there are definitely a lot more opportunities out there. There are lots of accelerator incubator, lots of organization that you can go there, join the community and learn from them. You don't have to basically even start the fundraising at the very, very beginning as also you mentioned. So basically you can even while you are basically building your idea, working on your idea, have your full-time job, start this idea and then you are more confident, kind of start be all in, start the company. And really if you believe in this mission, then you can take all of the challenges, you can try to see how you can build the company and just be confident. I think it's just know that it's not a thing that you can do and solve overnight may take some time, but you really need to work hard. And if you believe in them, this mission, just maybe talk to the right people, right advisors and get feedback from them and take it from there. If I was able to do that, I'm sure everybody can do it. I was a shy person not talking that much in the meetings. And so I was trying to maybe evolve to be a person that can lead the company, can build this company.

Nic Cary (22:54):

Well, pearls of wisdom across this whole interview. Thank you so much. I think if I could summarize some of the things you said that really resonated with me for entrepreneurs out there to think deeply about why they want to do something entrepreneurial, and it might be to have more economic independence or to serve a need in their community or potentially to change people's relationship with how they feed their pets and have a better impact on our climate and our food systems. And if you align with that mission, you'll have a deep reservoir of motivation for working through the inevitable difficult times and hard things that happen with running any company. But I think you also said something wise, which is to appreciate that it's a process that things do not happen overnight and you need to be methodical about working on the problems and constantly assessing them.

(23:43):

And so yeah, I think there's a lot that our listener should follow up on here. If you are a pet owner, you need to head to my pawco.com. You're going to find food that's been basically created for animals using all kinds of plant-based proteins. It's fresh, it's healthy, and the sciences coming in that says that helps our pets live longer and healthier and happy lives. And so really amazing work that you and the team are doing. And I thank you so much for coming on the Sky's the Limit podcast. So Dr. Vazin, we appreciate your time so much. And at skysthelimit.org, we connect underrepresented entrepreneurs with volunteer business professionals for free. one-on-one mentoring. We also provide business guides to all of our members and monthly funding opportunities so you can get bootstrapping your own business too. You can sign up for free today and if you like what you heard, please subscribe and share.

Outro (24:41):

Thanks for listening to the First Buck podcast. Don't forget to join the community of underrepresented entrepreneurs and their supporters by signing up at skysthelimit.org. Click subscribe and we'll see you next time.